Saturday, 28 December 2013

Olidammara – God of Thieves?

 I don't think so.

I've seen him referenced as such. For instance, Edition 3.5's Complete Warrior, page 11. When discussing the Prestige Class Swashbuckler, it says:

“Most swashbucklers pay at least some small amount of homage to Olidammara (god of thieves) since that deity is renowned as being lucky."

I think this is due to the fact that many of today's "younger" people have no idea as to the meaning of words. This shows in their creating a "so-called" Class named "Rogue." I suppose this was done to be "politically correct." Have I ever told you how much I despise "politically correct?" No? Well, we'll save that for another post.

The problem is that Swashbucklers are "Rogues." So are Bards.

In fact, I can testify and bear witness to the fact that Jason Zavoda, Ken Harrison, Skip Twitchell, Allan Grohe, Mike Bridges, Denis Tetreault – heck everyone in my "Readers" section and then some – are all, every one . . . Charming Rogues.

The problem? None of them are Thieves.

Yes, Bards are "rogues," Swashbucklers are "rogues" and I'm sure we can name a couple of other Classes that qualify as "rogues" . . . but they're not Thieves. Bard is a Class, Swashbuckler is a Class and Thief is a Class. Rogue? Rogue is a personality.

Captain Jack Sparrow is a "charming rogue," but he's not a thief. I know you're going to say that pirates are thieves. Well, that's true, but, in The Game, Jack Sparrow is a Swashbuckler, not a Thief and not a Bard. He's a Swashbuckler . . . who happens to be a very "charming rogue."

Also, every Thief that ever trusted to luck is in prison. Successful Thieves trust to skill, not luck. So, I give you . . . Dalt! Yes, Dalt, God of Portals, Doors, Enclosures, Locks and Keys. You're telling me that don't sound like a God of Thieves to you? Of course, Dalt only acknowledges those of Neutral Good or Chaotic Good leanings.

For "neutral" Thieves there's Kurell, God of Theft, amongst other things. Teaching his followers to "take what is rightfully theirs and to seize all their desire." You know, kind of like the way Kurell tried to take his brother's wife! Tsk.

For "evil," well, there's always Nerull, God of Murder, amongst other things, who seems to be favored by Assassins. After all, what is assassination but a form of murder? And what is murder? The theft of someone's life, the most precious thing you can steal! Yeah, "evil" Thieves have Nerull.

But Dalt is "the man." His Clerics are divided between those that "keep things locked and those who seek to open the locks . . . Dalt's clerics work to build locks and traps;" thieving specialties. Dalt's clerics even act "as instructors for . . . thieves, though they will only teach those that have the greater good in mind."

Yeah, Dalt beats Olidammara as the God of Thieves hands down. Olidammara might be the God of Rogues, be it Bards, Swashbucklers or select Thieves, but Dalt is the God of Thieves in particular.

Like I said, I believe the confusion comes from "younger" writers and editors not knowing the difference between a Thief and a Rogue. They're not the same thing.


  1. Thanks for the shout-out, Tony (even if somewhat mangled in spelling ;) ), and Happy New Year!: may 2014 find you full of good ideas that execute well, and in good health and spirits! :D


    1. Doh! Spelling corrected. I get to typing too fast sometimes.

      Thanks for the kind thoughts, Allan. Hope you had a great Midwinter's Night, a Merry Needfest and wishing you a GREAT 2014!

  2. Well, I wouldn't want to cast aspersions on anybody's character...but some of those charming rogues could be thieves. Or reformed theives. Just sayin'. ;)

    1. Didn't I say everyone in my "Readers" section? You ought to be ashamed . . . talking about yourself like that! LOL

  3. How does Rudd get no mention in the mix. God of luck and chances . Believes in making ones own luck. By being prepared to take on challenges. As opposed to relying on blind luck. Dalt is definitely a possibility especially for the typical adventuring thief. Rogue is akin to warrior IMHO. Fighters, Paladins, Rangers and Barbarian's all fall into that category. Bards, gallants, swashbucklers, thieves , assassins are all rogues. However, we went from a stereotypical society to one that is overtly politically correct. Sometimes a duck is just a duck not a feather aerial creature. Like schools that forbid the use of holiday celebrations because other people of different religious affiliations might not celebrate said holiday. As far as I'm concerned celebrate all holidays and by allowing every one of all ethnicity and religious backgrounds to divulge in these celebrations you bring about more acceptance. As is right now it just promotes another form of segregation.

    1. Hey! Are you disparaging ducks? None of that! I happen to like duck . . . especially Peking Duck, delicious! LOL

      And I'll remind you that I included Rudd in my last post! I was talking about the Feast of Fools, of course, still . . . ;)

      Rudd can be included, to be sure, still, I refer you to my comment about thieves trusting to luck, rather than skill. Dalt is the God of "Thinking" Thieves, rather than "Trusting Thieves."

      That better? :D

      And I agree with you on the holidays, simply included them all. Excluding any of them isn't going to "solve" anything.

  4. I can verify that Ken Harrison is a scoundrel. Without a doubt.

    1. I "feel" a snowball fight coming on! Woo-hoo!


  5. I agree that Olidammara is a better patron of bards than thieves. I always considered him equivalent to Bacchus.
    In my mind, Kurell is the primary God of Thieves.
    Don't forget Pyremius as a Power of Thieves, too, though primarily of assassins.